{
"post": {
"title": "Garius is a problem",
"selftext": "Anyone have any tips for going against this beast of a hero in arena? I usually use healing prohibition to stop characters from healing up but this guy just dispels and tanks my whole team. Should I be trying stuns/silence or skills that focus on slowing or draining energy for skills?\n\nI really think Garius needs a nerf. I hate to be that guy but he is far too good compared to other tanks that it really hurts choice/decision making when building a team since he is basically a given pick for his role.\n\nSpeaking of role, he is a great tank but also a great healer. He honestly does too much for one character. I personally think he needs his dispell removed from his ultimate.\n\nWhat are your opinions on this guy?",
"url": "https://www.reddit.com/r/Dragonheir_SilentGods/comments/18gn8ya/garius_is_a_problem/"
},
"comments": [
{
"body": "I wouldn't nerf garius - but I'd change arena structure from simply awarding the win to the defender if time runs out to something that favors offense. e.g., something like most people standing, increasing multipliers to attack/crit over time, most damage done, whatever, there are tons of options if they wanted to revamp that don't involve nerfing a specific unit.\n\nHe can be dealt with, but I think he's more of an issue early game when you don't have gear yet to put together a solid offensive team, which is a time period the devs probably should care about since you need people to get past early game to convert them to spenders.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "Totally agree with this. Garius doesn’t need a nerf, the Arena Structure needs to be revamped to favor offense over defense.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "Deffinetly. This has been commonly talked about on discord, we really need a change to arena"
}
]
},
{
"body": "I think you nailed it with this comment."
},
{
"body": "Gaius needs a nerf in arena, not the only problem but the in this discution its about him so I won't mention the other problems, he is 2 champions in one, he is a tank and a healer, some times even better then a dedicated healer, arena is fine after all you initiate the atack, you can plan acording to the enemy, they don't have this posibility, so its fair that the one who is afk gets the winn when time runs out, if you want to fix arena fix the champs that are the problem, there should not bee champs that can staal you out, and non that just kill everithing. Winning should bee about having the right tool (in this case geear) on the champ not the op champ that winns all. "
}
]
},
{
"body": "Stall teams using him are a pain but other tanks synergize with other teams (Ergander+Sigrid for example). In most teams Garius alone isn't that much of an issue unless you lost 2 heroes before dealing with him or have no way of dealing with the teams backline first. The current affinity pairing with some of the nasty lightning control-heroes can is an issue with him but that doesn't justify a nerf to him (and i absolutely don't want him weaker in pve).\n\nGarius can be overpowered with enough dps, jumpers can kill the backline and allow you to focus Garius alone. Control skills can do massive work against him as well as he is usualy not build with much resistances. In addition try to get a single affinity team for an optimal amount of bonusses.\n\nAnother approach for Season 2 can be the gear that will reduce max HP but thats a thing that has to be tested and won't help you now.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "I think I'm just lacking the DPS. This time I was able to kill his whole team off but couldn't kill Garius 5v1. I'm not sure I have the right characters at the moment but I will experiment with what I have when facing him.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "lacking dps, i remember early game it was a pain to kill him off. Later on he is nothing special. Healing prohibition works even if he can remove it, you just need to stop healing from hits between his ults. Preferably gently caress him before he ever ults. \n\n2nd option i used was delay his heal. Did this in sparkle tournament against a garius i could not kill between ults. Dropped accuracy on horus and boom 5 extra seconds of no ult to molest him.\n\nYou can probably dispel his damage reduction, idk as i dont have the hero nor have i bothered to read his skills."
},
{
"body": "No, I atacked once a garius who was solo thinking o 1v5 easy... could not kill him with 0 support, he has a cleans so you can only over damage him or delay his ult but! He has good evasion so that is hard and he can full healty from 30% life so the only real soluționa îs over damage him, good luck doing that like I said he solo staaled my whole team 1v5 "
}
]
}
]
},
{
"body": "A high defense, Scarab-wearing Garius with high resist is nearly unkillable if you don't have 4 legit DPS. Heal blocks and even stuns don't work. My advice is that unless you're running a high DPS team, always check his resist. If it's 300 range, find a different team.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "the fact u have to do all of this for ONE GUY is stupid and should definitely justify a nerf. this problem has been here since last year, why is he still a problem, as an epic character??? no legendary has given me this much grief."
}
]
},
{
"body": "Yea, he heals better than a dedicated healer, is tankier than a dedicated tank, and is basically immune to healing debuff. I can kill everyone else on the enemy team and keep all my dps, but he'll just tank until the time runs out.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "This is exactly what is happening to me."
},
{
"body": "ME to "
}
]
},
{
"body": "How do you beat him? With a stick, while he sleeps. But in arena, with legendary gear, that man is unstoppable"
},
{
"body": "Use heroes that block healing. You’ll still need a lot of dmg so Pair them with interrupters or mobile heroes to try to get right at the back while your ranged pound him. Or just hammer him with nukers I guess. But you have to block his hit heal and his ult that’s key. Or just have mad legos and smash. But I can’t do that so I do this instead."
},
{
"body": "I love garius teams, they are nom noms for rating. But in all seriousness, you have to be really particular about how you approach garius. You're choices are to run dive and finish backline first then mob rush garius last ,\n\nOr use a heavy hitter single target DPS x2 for the garius off the bat, ideally you should be able to nuke the garius before his first ult comes off. I do this with a dauntless team, Lola stun and sutha and Garret nuke the piss out of him and he should be dead without issues.\n\n That being said, always pair garius as your tank against another garius if it's a garius sigrid team. Rather than trying to survive you should be focusing on nuking the garius before your DPS dies then garius will solo the rest.\n\nIf it's a garius stall team with like 3 tanks then you need crowd control to slow down their ults and create an opening for your main dps.\n\nIf it's a garius revive team; cry yourself to sleep. Your DPS will be ping ponging and it really just feels like luck at that point."
},
{
"body": "I have seen arena with JUST HIM and lost. My hole team could not beat him alone.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "I tried all, debuff, stun, char, heal prohibition nothing worked he just 1v5 stall my whole team "
}
]
},
{
"body": "Just gotta find other ways to deal with him. Arena is partially strategy afterall, someone shouldn't expect to always be able to bring in their team and beat everything, that's not how competition works.\n\nIf we nerfed every hero someone had a personal problem dealing with this game would just be nerfs. Saying a unit needs a nerf because you're having a hard time against it is pretty wild.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "It really isn't that wild to ask for a slight nerf. I feel like the character is a little brain dead and can fit into almost any team while other tanks require some synergy to perform well. Am I dead wrong to say that it takes a lot more thought to counter Garius than to fit him in a team?\n\nHe is a tank and a healer that debuffs himself (which prevents the easiest counter for dealing with healing [healing prohibition]. Using Garius is easy, countering him is not. I'm new so I'm sure once I have more options I will figure out how to better address him but in my opinion I feel he offers a little to much compared to most tanks.\n\nI have a lot to learn so maybe I'm just dead wrong and need to get gud but Garius feels poorly balanced comparatively in a game that I feel has done really well with balancing.\n\nWhat is your advice for taking Garius down?",
"replies": [
{
"body": "If you can't 1v5 Garius it isn't a Garius issue. It's a you issue. I don't have issues with him because I count on him being the last one left on the field. I kill everyone else with aoe and backline jumpers, then finish him off.\n\nStall teams are a huge part of the meta right now, and that is the main and legitimate complaint. But the teams people complain about are ones where most of the team survives, and just keeps surviving until the time runs out. If you're getting stalled out by one hero, that's purely a skill issue.\n\nPut stun gear on one of your heroes, you can also bring in other forms of control and ultimate reduction. He only cleanses himself, so when my Sigrid hits everyone else and they get heal blocked, he can't heal them.\n\nThere are multiple different ways to deal with him, I have more issues with Horrus than I do Garius but I'm not out here asking for nerfs.\n\nIf you're having a problem with Garius, wait until you get high enough to fight real stall comps, often with aoe resurrection and ridiculous healing and utility. If you have issues with 1 garius, wait till there are the equivalent of 5 out there.\n\nAnd again, I can't emphasize this enough. New players shouldn't be talking about heroes needing nerfs. If you're new then you should know you're inexperienced. Do you expect all inexperienced players to just be able to walk through pvp? No, it takes game knowledge, strategy, having more/the right heroes.\n\nTop tier PvP is for whales. Mid tier PvP for us mere mortals still requires strategy and game knowledge.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "I used to struggle with Horrus but I have figured out how to consistently deal with him.\n\nI understand your sentiment about me being new player. I will bring up one counter argument though. You want new players to stick around. New players are going to struggle to obtain the right heroes that not only have the utility but the damage as well and then gear them out properly to handle a brain dead hero that seemingly only needs defense and resist on their gear. \n\nI understand I have a lot to learn and I'm having a blast doing it. Learning to use invisibility spells to keep my back line alive so certain characters can't jump on them and wreck them is fun. Using a debuff support against teams that stack buffs is fun. Learning when to add a support that cleanse the debuffs on your team against certain comps is fun. Figuring out how to stomp Furbath (the troll guy l, not sure I got the name right) and Horrus was fun. Using heroes that can get to the back line to kill that pesky hero who revives her allies was fun. I'm not a genius but I'm also not braindead.\n\nGarius might be better balanced on the higher end of PVP but in lower tiers where new players exist, Garius is a crutch and is included in most teams even if his element doesn't align. Remember we haven't unlocked the bonus for 5 matching elemental heroes yet so this tactic has no downside at this level. You said to put stun gear on my heroes but I can't farm stun gear yet. The effort it takes to use Garius effectively vs the effort it takes to counter him is no where close and that is the problem that I don't think you quite understand. New players are ill equipped to handle Garius. This will lead to \"quit moments\" for new players. \n\nIn the end I expect Garius is nothing but an early warning sign on the issues that the arena has, which is, it favors defense way to much. Personally my defense team is built solely to survive, I'm guessing it is a common strategy.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "Wait so you think when I started my account Garius wasn't around? Lol. I'm not crazy good at the game, I'm just top 150 on my server which is pretty mid, but I don't see how anything you've said strengthens your case?\n\nEarly on you'll have all kinds of issue in PvP depending on what you have available. Full stop, that's it. Skip Garius defenses or check his equipment beforehand to see how tanky he is if you can't get the dps to figure it out.\n\nAlso, trying to climb in pvp early on is a fools errand unless you spend a lot or get lucky. Set a 1 hero defense and then your pvp battles will be easy enough since you'll stay low in the rankings.\n\nIf someone leaves the game because they can't deal with Garius in PvP early on, they will quit for a billion other reasons anyways even if he didn't exist.\n\nAnd yes, as I previously noted the game heavily favours stall comps in pvp. The devs have already said they're looking into it and working on what they can do to make it more balanced. That won't have much to do with nerfing units like Garius though, that's for sure.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "\"Early on you'll have all kinds of issue in PvP depending on what you have available.\" \n\nWell I agree with that statement. I guess we feel differently about Garius and his balance in early game PvP. Regardless of our difference in opinion I thank you for the advice on how to beat him. I'm going to keep experimenting and working to put the pieces together to stomp him into the ground. Thanks.",
"replies": [
{
"body": "Np. Honestly 90% of pvp offense till near top tier can be Sigrid + Voresh + 3. No one should do well in PvP early on unless you're on a brand new server and/or a whale.\n\nNo one should expect to just keep climbing in pvp as a new player imo."
}
]
}
]
}
]
},
{
"body": "Horrus? BS all you need to kill him is debuff, you can`t debuff or healingprohibit Garius, other then Horrus he has bonus defense that can not bee didpelled and self cleans, Horrus is nothing comparred to Graius",
"replies": [
{
"body": "I posted this weeks ago and from the sound of things you're dying to Garius which means you aren't fighting in the higher pvp rankings.\n\nI didn't have issues killing Garius however Horrus would sometimes screw up my team as it has a taunt and with 5 hero affinity would often be paired with fire MC who was DEADLY s1 (i barely play s2, idk how much has changed in pvp)."
}
]
}
]
}
]
},
{
"body": "Just remove his cleans, thats all, I can kill his whole teem and loose to a 1v5 because of time, you say its not fair to have one teem beat all, but how is it fair to kill the whole teem exept him and loos? I even lost with my whole team 1v5, he had no other champs and I still lost, how is that fair? ",
"replies": [
{
"body": "It's fair because it forces you to change things up instead of just plowing through with your 1 team over and over. Same as I said before.\n\nNow, they said they would make changes so that stall teams wouldn't be the meta. So wait for those changes and see if it impacts any of these teams that rely on being super tanky and time running out.\n\nYou can do silence, charm, knock up, taunt etc on Garius. Have you tried literally any of those things?"
}
]
}
]
},
{
"body": "What’s fair about killing everyone in the first 30 seconds only to get stalled the other 4 and a half minutes to get a loss!!!! He does everything in the damn game besides summon a damn minion and rez!!! He even has crowd control with that knockup!!! He is a JOKE!! A total unbalance and massive power creep on a scale of unimaginable!!! Whatever idiot designed his load out needs to be let go!! A healer heals a tank will tank the dmg a cleanser will remove buffs crowd control stun locks and immobilizes their target this JOKE OF A HERO DOES ALL OF THEM SIGNIFICANTLY BETTER THAN THE SET CLASS HEROS THAT ARE MADE FOR THAT CERTAIN SETUP YOU DONT GIVE ALL THIS TO A TANK AND NOT LIMIT HEALS OVER TIME!!! I’ve never played a game where everyone uses the same hero no matter what opponent you pick he is on the team!!! DELETE HIM OR DELETE EVERY OTHER HERO BESIDES HIM!! THEY COULDNT EVEN HIRE A DECENT VOICE ACTOR!!! HE HAS LIKE 4 COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PEOPLE DOING HIS VOICEOVERS!! He was just thrown together as fast as possible without testing obviously and now they can’t nerf him because all the players abusing his kit will cry over it and the rest will get sick of his annoying ass voice and constant heal spams and delete their account like I’m doing!! It must have been take your kid to work day and the owners kid threw this shit together!!! The kid probably did the voiceovers too!! I hope this hero kills this game since they have no plans on fixing his broken kit “ he will conquer all” yeah we know kid your dad owns the place. I refuse to use him like the rest of the others 99.9% of the player base does!! Over a half a year and still ruining arena!!! I bet he killed a good portion of the player base!!! Who wants to listen to his annoying voice every match telling us how awesome he is because his dad is the conqueror of the company!!! Not to mention garius’s voice is the same voice as like 5 other hero’s!!!!! REALLY COULDNT FIND A BUM ON THE STREETS TO DO IT FOR A PACK OF JUICY FRUIT GUM!!!!"
},
{
"body": "I have Vinyara, so Garius is not a problem."
},
{
"body": "Just need more dps"
},
{
"body": "I think arena just need some changes like creating a nerf, healing prohibition or dot when you reach like 2 minutes combat. That would stop with the tank defense meta"
}
]
}