Rufous

As Gaming Giants Are Shutting Out Russia from Their Services ...

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{
  "post": {
    "title": "As Gaming Giants Are Shutting Out Russia from Their Services, GGG's Silence is Becoming Deafening",
    "selftext": "Last night, Activision-Blizzard joined Microsoft, Electronic Arts, CD Project Red, Rockstar, and others as the largest gaming companies in the world have suspended sales and services to Russia.  Organizations around the world are cancelling their contracts and pulling out of Russia in solidarity with the people of Ukraine, and even smaller businesses with less pull are organizing fundraisers.  Meanwhile, GGG is literally silent about the issue.  At this point, GGG is one of the only companies that I do business with that has remained completely silent about what's happening.\n\nWill GGG ever address the situation with Russia/Ukraine?  Or will their Chinese overlords at Tencent keep them quiet and docile?",
    "url": "https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/t75yt7/as_gaming_giants_are_shutting_out_russia_from/"
  },
  "comments": [
    {
      "body": "There are a few reasons why, IMO:\n\n- GGG belongs to Tencent. China is siding with Russia.\n\n- By amount of russians I see doing trade and in highlight reels, I dedudct that a large portion of players are russian (hence the downvotes on your post), more than usual. (Minus CS:GO probably). \n\n- Acting \"neutral\" is always financially beneficial\n\nSo yeah, I don't expect GGG to releases an announcement. And I am terribly disappointed in them."
    },
    {
      "body": "Being neutral in a conflict is now immoral?",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Side 1: Murders civilian children\n\nSide 2: Please don't murder our civilian children\n\nCenter: maybe murder just a few? \n\nIf you get randomly punched in the face, it's not a conflict. It's an attack. Being \"neutral\" is only helping one side.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Except side2 also murders people",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "Are you able to comprehend the difference between an attacker and a defender?",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "killing people is a tragedy of both sides",
                      "replies": [
                        {
                          "body": "Who's saying it isn't?",
                          "replies": [
                            {
                              "body": "what's the difference then?",
                              "replies": [
                                {
                                  "body": "I'll take that as a serious question.\n\nImagine an a random person barges in your neighbours home and starts shooting. They shoot the neighbour's child/mother/wife, they kill their dog, and demand the neighbour surrender their house, because they're not using it properly.  The neighbour shoots and kills the attacker, because the attacker threatened to kill the neighbour.\n\nDo you, as the neighbour's neighbour, think:\n\na) \"Well that's terrible, both sides killed prople, but neither is at fault\" (neutral) \n\nb) The attacker is clearly at fault, if they didn't enter the house, none of this would have happened\n\nc) The neighbour is at fault, because thry should've let the attacker take their house without resisting."
                                }
                              ]
                            }
                          ]
                        },
                        {
                          "body": "Rapists and murderers dying is not that big of a tragedy. Innocent people dying is the real tragedy. Innocent people are only dying on one side."
                        }
                      ]
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        },
        {
          "body": "Maybe"
        },
        {
          "body": "If you will be neutral long enough one day you will be destroyed by someone who isn't neutral",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Or maybe you'll be the only one left when non neutrals all kill each other."
            }
          ]
        },
        {
          "body": "You sit in a room with 2 other people: a man and a woman. That man begins to assault the woman. Now you tell me, is doing nothing about it and being \"neutral in a conflict\" immoral?",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "I would not sit in such a room. Situation is unrealistic"
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "You could argue that games are way to get past censorship, so it would be good that they would be available. Thou id argue that these companies are hypocrits and only do these kind of things when its beneficial to them."
    },
    {
      "body": "dude i play poe to escape from the horrors of the world. this shit honestly gives me anxiety cuz its getting worse every day (the whole conflict).",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Good for you. Unfortunately I can't play poe to escape reality because I had to flee my city because it's being shelled. Obviously had to leave my PC and pretty much everything else I had.\n\nMeanwhile I see some russians on Discord cheering for the war in chat and then playing poe. Feels great that people who support terrorism (not just by cheering but also by paying taxes in russia) get to play while I don't."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "There is zero reason to do so, really. It's not any citizen's fault that a country has made a decision.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "War time sanctions are not about hurting Russian people because they deserve it, it's about putting pressure on them to deal with the issue internally are wearing the internal workings and economy that the government has no choice but to stop. We are dealing with a nuclear super power, the only way out of this situation is Russian literally revolting or Putin decides he suddenly cares about the Russian people."
        },
        {
          "body": "that's not how economic sanctions work"
        },
        {
          "body": "By that logic there is zero reason for any sanctions right? We should let them carry on because it might inconvenience random citizens? You really haven't thought this through.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "exactly. it isnt random citizens decision, fault or even responsibility. thus any company that does actions against citizens, not the government, are nothing more than populism",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "Wow, didn't realize the pro-Russian shills were so brazen. How exactly should sanctions be implemented without hurting the citizens then? It's good that the sanctions do in fact hurt the Russian populace. Putin needs to be overthrown and only the Russian people can do that.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "I'm from another country and sanctions hurt me as well, wtf?"
                    },
                    {
                      "body": "[removed]"
                    }
                  ]
                },
                {
                  "body": "[removed]",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "Ive checked - im ok",
                      "replies": [
                        {
                          "body": "I don't think stupid people realize they're stupid. Case in point...",
                          "replies": [
                            {
                              "body": "Yup. Thats why I've used a medical service to check that out. So i wasnt the one to judge me"
                            }
                          ]
                        }
                      ]
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            },
            {
              "body": "[deleted]",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "It's 'Ukraine' and not 'the Ukraine'\n\nConsider supporting anti-war efforts in any possible way: [[Help 2 Ukraine](https://help2ukraine.org)] 💙💛\n\n[[Merriam-Webster](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/Ukraine)] [[BBC Styleguide](https://www.bbc.co.uk/newsstyleguide/u)]\n\n^(Beep boop I’m a bot)",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "Bot can't see context?"
                    }
                  ]
                },
                {
                  "body": "And GGG is doing nothing.  They're not raising money, they're not stopping sales, they literally aren't doing a thing.  No moral backbone.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "Why should they? And any other company during any other ongoing and finished war?"
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        },
        {
          "body": "Russian citizens are now killing innocent people, kids and shelling hospitals with cluster bombs.\nNot abstract `country` or `government`. Just regular russian"
        },
        {
          "body": "It's is EVERY single one Russian citizen fault. Literally. Every single one contributed to Putin to giv ehim so much power OR was silent when shouldn't. And I'm telling it from Sumy, Ukraine, where I get bombed every single day\n\nDont tell me they can't do anything. In Ukraine we did revolution in 2014. They had to do it years ago. They have to do it now. Russia has 144mln people, together they can ruin Putins fashizm propaganda. But they afraid. Russians are fucking peazents, so they don't deserve having Coca-Cola, Netflix or Path of Exile",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Cola is staying btw. They don't need this cringe populistic move to stay at international market",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "Lol. \nhttps://www.reuters.com/business/retail-consumer/pepsico-explores-options-russian-business-wsj-2022-03-08/",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "it is another example of information speculation and populism\n\ncoca-cola company is not the one who produces and sells soda at russia. coca-cola hbc does. coca-cola company suspended marketing and investments, while hbc still produces and selling drinks",
                      "replies": [
                        {
                          "body": "They're still on the fence. Let's hope they make the right decision and cut ties with Russia. At least for now."
                        }
                      ]
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            },
            {
              "body": "Yeah, of course. Those 15 yo Russians who just want to play a game deserve this bc it's obviously their fault. Thanks, I opened my eyes now. Fuck Russians.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "POE is 18+, just letting you know",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "Elections too, just letting you know",
                      "replies": [
                        {
                          "body": "Russian elections aren't real though..."
                        }
                      ]
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "I am Polish living in Russia and I am against it. I won't have my ass beaten up, because police is doing so from what I've heard at the peaceful protests. Propaganda in TV and social media. I think a that people playing video games are aware of what is happening"
    },
    {
      "body": "Why does a game company need to act on political events? Why cant we just play the game? Not everything needs to include politics.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "\"stop caring about people dying in war and a nuclear super power continuously invading more countries and lemme just play my game\"\n\nIt's insane the mentality people have about \"politics\". Any sane person should care about what is happening, in fact they should have cared a long time ago.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Just because they don't want it to affect PoE doesn't mean they aren't aware and can't have feelings about it."
            },
            {
              "body": "Some of us play to get away from this crap. It's everywhere on every medium. \n\nWars happen all over the world at any given time. I never see you guys giving a shit about Africa. Just let us play and get the politics out of this.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "No. Politics is part of life, an extremely important part. Hate to tell you but anti-war people do talk about other wars. The issue right here is who is involved and why.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "Lol stop deleting your comments. I keep getting alerts and parts of what your saying, then it's gone when I go look at it."
                    },
                    {
                      "body": "No. I play games to relax, not discuss politics. There is a time and place for things. If you can't separate the two it is your problem not mine. \n\nYou talk about other wars but make no buzz about it. I've never seen someone say we should boycott African goods to keep money away from the warlords."
                    },
                    {
                      "body": "Interesting. I can see them on your profile, but not in the chain.\n\nGranted they are not the nicest comments. So I'm sure I'm better off without."
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            },
            {
              "body": "[removed]",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "[removed]"
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": ">tfw my video game company won't virtue signal with me \n\n://////",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Virtue signal? My god you people are mentally ill. Pressure on the citizens of an invading nuclear super power is not virtue signaling. It's the world attempting to put enough pressure on the populace to make their government stop.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": ">Virtue signal? My god you people are mentally ill\n\nYeah man, I'm sure that stopping 14 year old Ivan from playing games in his house is going to get him to go outside and rebel against the armed guards at the Kremlin.\n\nGet off your high horse thinking that you're doing anything"
            },
            {
              "body": "Lol good luck with that. People that are vilified typically stand together not fall apart. \n\nSo instead of having anti Russian propaganda on their mediums they just block them out so they can only get state fed media. \n\nGreat idea.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "Yeah, destabilizing a country via cutting them off from the majority of the world isn't a thing anyone has ever done.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "Lol you think they can't get goods from China? Cutting off the population from world luxuries isn't going to stop this. This is just blowing a horn to say what a good boy you are. \n\nRussia will be a cult of personality if Putin manages to keep his people fed and in somewhat good shape.  They are also taking more and more of Ukraine day by day. Ukraine was one of the breadbaskets of the old union. Nothing short of military intervention will stop this, and that opens a huge can of worms since the old leaders signed a bunch of bad deals."
                    },
                    {
                      "body": "Lol you deleted that fast.",
                      "replies": [
                        {
                          "body": "No I didn't?",
                          "replies": [
                            {
                              "body": "Wish I had done a screen shot. In our chain someone just made a comment about how I said to destabilize china. \n\nWhen I alluded to no such thing. \n\nWouldn't be a bad idea in this case though."
                            }
                          ]
                        }
                      ]
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            },
            {
              "body": "I think it might be a bit different when the country leader is a dictator. I'm sure the Jewish people stood up to Hitler too. You might need to check how reality works. It's a different life then being in a country that allows freedom to protest."
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "If tencent is the defining choice its not going to happen. China doesn't give a fuck about it.\n\nAnd thirdly the people of Russia that are playing poe aren't invading Ukraine?",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "So? Are they not the soldiers that are going there? Are they not the people shooting the guns and bombing the towns? Are the ones at home not the ones tolerating this war or even advocating for it?   \nYes they are victims of a very powerful propaganda machine and its not fair but for the world to prevent a 2nd cold war or even a 3rd worldwar the only chance would be for Russia to solve this internally and the best chance for this happening would be by an uprise of the russian people.   \n\n\nWhat these gaming companies should do is not banning russians or ending support for them. They should use the games to send real news to these people to counter russian propaganda and make the russian people see the truth. However the biggest part of the russian population will not be hit much by sanctions in video games but in 1-3 weeks from now they will be very hungry... They believe that they do not need the rest of the world because of the propaganda they are fed.   \nEven if people start to doubt what they are told it needs A LOT to change ones believes, especially when it makes your side the bad guy..."
        },
        {
          "body": "Every russian who is sitting silently now and playing games - regime supporter",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "So what are they supposed to do? It wasn't their choice to invade, they didn't take arms up to invade? And if they do appose in a country like that they will go missing"
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "From what I understand they are jn a no politic kinda policy which is fair enough I think",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Yes, because profits."
        },
        {
          "body": "\"no politics\" always means total complacency with nazi fucks\n\nsame as both siding",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "So Switzerland is a nazi country, right? Or Sweden? Or Turkey?",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "turkey LMFAO"
                },
                {
                  "body": "Don't google \"Switzerland Nazi gold\""
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "GGG is indirectly owned by the CCP,  are you really surprised ?"
    },
    {
      "body": "kekw"
    },
    {
      "body": "This loud russophobia is somewhat unsettling. Organized hatred toward ethnic groups hasn't served the west well (think of slavery in the US and nazi Germany...)",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "While I think that stopping regular Russians from playing games in their free time is exaggerated, so is comparing that to Nazis and slavery.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Sanctioning or discriminating someone based on their ethnicity isn't that far from those. Punishing regular Russians just for being Russian is simply unacceptable."
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Mentioning the conflict at all in global chat gets you a warning for discussing inflammatory subjects if someone reports you, and there are a lot of pro-Russian useful idiots in the chat ready to report you. I would have hoped that GGG would have issued a statement at this point but I'm not surprised they haven't based on my view of the company.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "They have had a \"no politics\" rule in Global Chat since around 2016, this has nothing to do with the current Ukraine-Russian conflict specifically",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "How are updates about the war political? Just mentioning how it's going isn't political in and of itself.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "Because it will shift very very quickly into a political debate.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "So yes you confirm it's not political. And i agree, it most likely will return political fast, and then you can start warning people. A blanket can on anything even remotely related to politics is stupid and weak."
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            },
            {
              "body": "Actually their \"No Politics\" rule came around when they were purchased by Tencent.  Go figure."
            }
          ]
        },
        {
          "body": "GGG is a game company focused on making exactly 1 game, they aren't a big studio or developer that has anywhere near the impact that microsoft, sony, even cd projekt red.\n\nWhile the situation in Ukraine is far from ideal, I'm not sure why its the responsibility or why companies should need to feel the pressure to stop servicing a specific region because of actions that are largely out of the control of the general population, especially in russia.   Sure they can go protest and get locked up, sure they could do something, but perhaps what people in Russia need that can't have an impact, is the ability to escape.\n\nVideo games are one of the best forms of escape out there.   And I personally believe that its important to remember what the goal of GGG and other game developers are.  The goal is to make a game, not to influence governments, not to get into the political theater.\n\nLast time I checked even Valve wasn't doing anything.  How can so many people here try and want to hold GGG accountable for something really that has nothing to do with them.   How can some people here, including OP think that withholding funding from GGG because they don't get political makes any sense.\n\nJust think for a little bit about the situation and put yourself in everyone's shoes.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Just think a little bit about it yourself. This is a defining moment in our history, opting to not support a company that won't openly support Ukraine at a time like this is not only the logical thing to do, but the morally correct thing to do. GGG can do whatever they want and I can do whatever I want. And that is to never support GGG ever again. Feel genuinely disappointed by this community, what an absolute let down.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "For all you know Chris could have personally donated over a million dollars and made contributions but not publicized it.\n\nThen again, its only in a company's best interest to get involved in politics because its the popular thing to do is to support this particular instance of it.   In general its not in a company's best interest to be involved publicly with anything political.\n\n\nYou feel generally disappointed that GGG doesn't just focus on their jobs and what their goal and mission statement is?   People here love to bitch about how GGG doesn't do enough in the time between leagues and here you are wanting them to work on cutting off access to a group of people in a region, here you are wanting them to make a political statement as a gaming company.\n\nIts been a sad few weeks leading up and including this conflict, but we need to keep in mind that not every person and company needs to or should get political publicly."
                },
                {
                  "body": "Jesus, defining moment in our history? This? \n\nIt's a damn game company with no sway whatsoever in regional or international politics.  \n\nTake the politics to a politics board."
                }
              ]
            },
            {
              "body": "It's not about political theater, it's about having morals and not doing business with evil.  Foreign companies cancelled contracts when the US invaded Iraq and we deserved it, just like Russia deserves it now.  A lot of us have gotten comfortable not fighting for things, but eventually everyone needs to take a stand.  Life isn't about hiding and being distracted when the people around you are causing death and destruction.\n\nAs far as Valve not doing anything, that's fair, but I don't buy Valve products (in fact, I do my best not to buy from Steam period).  I have spent a lot of money on PoE, so I'm more concerned with what they do.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "> . Foreign companies cancelled contracts when the US invaded Iraq and we deserved it, just like Russia deserves it now.\n\nDid they ever turn off services to games, movies and other media, probably not.   Because thats not the goal of those companies.\n\nYou think that you spending money on POE should dictate how they handle a political incident across the world?   I feel you get what you spend, which is mtx, merch and points for future MTX.  I don't think its right for russia to invade another country, but then again I don't think its right for people to demand a gaming company get political.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "They likely didn't because a ton of entertainment products are made in America or our allies to begin with.\n\nAnd yes, as I've stated before, I feel that people that spend money on a product should have a say in how the company handles itself.  If GGG disagrees and wants to say silent that's fine; I'll simply take my money elsewhere."
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
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      ]
    }
  ]
}