Rufous

Which generation of Assassin's Creed games have the best ...

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{
  "post": {
    "title": "Which generation of Assassin's Creed games have the best gameplay mechanics?",
    "selftext": "I've been seeing a lot of differing opinions on which generation of games are best, and they all mainly relate to the actual gameplay rather than other elements. \n\nI think we can all agree Assassin's Creed does an amazing job of the locations to explore, and the story is always a bit hit or miss. \n\nIt's clear to see there's three main generations of Assassin's Creed games, the first generation being AC1-Black Flag - overall the same system, just *attempted* improvements on different features. Next up we have Unity and Syndicate. Then the RPG trilogy.\n\nBut overall, the thing that gets the community divided, is no doubt gameplay mechanics. With that in mind, which games had the best gameplay, in terms of stealth, combat and parkour?",
    "url": "https://www.reddit.com/r/assassinscreed/comments/13i421g/which_generation_of_assassins_creed_games_have/"
  },
  "comments": [
    {
      "body": "I think the way you're splitting up the \"generations\" is not quite right. In terms of gameplay and the engines that the games operate on, it's more like the following:\n\n**Gen 1**  \nAC  \nAC II  \nAC: Brotherhood  \nAC: Revelations\n\n**Gen 2**  \nAC III  \nAC: Black Flag  \nAC: Rogue\n\n**Gen 3**  \nAC: Unity  \nAC: Syndicate\n\n**Gen 4**  \nAC: Origins  \nAC: Odyssey  \nAC: Valhalla\n\nThe only difference is that the first generation ends after Revelations, because the subsequent entries were made with the updated [AnvilNext 1.0.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubisoft_Anvil)\n\n>stealth, combat and parkour?\n\nThis is the tricky thing. Each incarnation of the AC game engine excels at a few things in particular; it's not so clear which is the better of them all.\n\n**Gen 1** gave the player more direct control over the parkour, despite the janky animations. Stealth was unnatural because of the camera's relationship with the PC and the lack of crouching/cover. Combat was satisfying in small numbers but too easy and repetitive in larger encounters.\n\n**Gen 2** saw huge improvements in stealth but with more fluid animations, the parkour became a little unpredictable and more control has to be given to the computer for efficient traversal. Again, combat was very fun in small bursts with the excellent executions and more ranged options, but fighting on cramped ships gave rise to lots of bugs.\n\nI haven't played Unity or Syndicate so I can't speak for those, but it seems the animations are even more fluid and out of the player's control, and there's a greater focus on the smaller scale of things with indoor stealth and hiding behind small objects.\n\n**Gen 4** stripped down a lot of the stealth by making it closer to Gen 1 — that is, in directing your attention to the wider environment. However, horseback combat was greatly improved and there were better opportunities for large encounters on battlefields or outposts.\n\nPersonally I love the feel of the AC3—Rogue period: it takes away some of the finicky controls without leaving you helpless, and it really helps in fuelling the immersion.\n\nThe non-lethal options are also excellent, whereas in previous games I'd get nauseous with the amount of dead bodies. I like being rewarded for choosing my battles carefully and having options for how I approach a situation.\n\nThat said, the huge open-world expanses of the RPG trilogy *really* appeal to my desire for exploration.\n\nThose are my observations. Feel free to correct me on any of them or respond with your own.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "This is a great breakdown, thanks"
        },
        {
          "body": "Nailed it."
        },
        {
          "body": "I agree with everything except the nausea at dead bodies..\n\nAllow me to clear your sight on Gen 3.\n\nWhere Gen 1 was the creation period. Every iteration was an improvement. \n\nAnd Gen 2 was a refining period. Making game mechanics smoother and cinematically breathtaking.\n\nGen 3 was.. experimental we'll say.. Unity and Syndicate are my least favorite entries. But at least I beat Unity. Try as I may, I can't ever finish Syndicate. The combat is so unfulfilling to me. \n\nI'm glad you didn't mention the Chronicles Trilogy. Each of those settings DESERVED a full title release. Instead we were given 2.5D Abominations. As far as I'm concerned, if the community never mentions them again, their memory can fade to nothing.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "That's an interesting way of looking at Generations 1 & 2.\n\nThe opinions on Unity and Syndicate seem to be heavily polarised, though there are some common issues that most would agree on regardless of their preferences.\n\nI honestly have no idea which side I'd fall on: as much as I appreciate beautiful animations and experimental movement systems, I think I treasure tight and responsive controls more.\n\nAt the very least, I definitely intend on trying them both someday. I'm really eager to see 19th-century(?) London, if nothing else.\n\nI've only played up to Black Flag and (tried to run) Origins for a little while, so I'm waiting until I have a better PC and my own place to give the subsequent games the attention and patience(!) they require.\n\n>I'm glad you didn't mention the Chronicles Trilogy. Each of those settings DESERVED a full title release. Instead we were given 2.5D Abominations.\n\nDamn right. The concepts were so interesting and Ubisoft could have definitely pulled them off as smaller-scale spin-off games with full 3D gameplay without breaking the bank. So much unused potential. [What a shame.](https://youtu.be/09vVF-Hvykg)\n\n>...their memory can fade to nothing.\n\nI hoped that they could serve as a lesson learned for Ubisoft, but alas...\n\nAt least we're getting Assassin's Creed RED! We might be able to speculate on its quality after Mirage comes out."
            }
          ]
        },
        {
          "body": "I get the literal terms of different engines they operate on, but in terms of dramatic changes Unity was a soft reboot to what came before gameplay wise, with the others being merely improvement on past iterations. \n\nI agree with all the points made about each generation. I’m one of those that argue Unity/Syndicate parkour is fine, once you learn to use it correctly though. \n\nThe big thing is definitely the earlier games combat getting repetitive against large groups. That’s why I prefer Unity/Syndicate as you actually feel a sense of danger going against a large group, whereas in Black Flag for instance, you could be surrounded by 50 enemies and easily defeat them."
        },
        {
          "body": "The rpg trilogy didn't just improve horse combat, it improved combat in general",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "It changed the combat yes- but that’s not necessarily an all around improvement. I preferred the context based system, the rpg mechanics were too repetitive imo.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "The ac combat before the rpg trilogy was the definition of repetitive, just parry and counter attack.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "It sounds like you just didn’t explore the mechanics well enough. There was much more you could do besides parry and counter attack, including merging parkour with tools. Everything was context based so a tackle could become a dodge if the enemy was facing you the right way or the rope dart becoming a choke between obstacles- etc.",
                      "replies": [
                        {
                          "body": "But why bother? In 9/10 scenarios you could win any fight by parry then countering, it was in fact most often the easiest way to win the fight. Now granted the the rpg trilogy also kinda fell in this hole with oneshot abilities, but I applaud the effort and it can be quite fun to actually have different playstyles from weapons and or skills."
                        }
                      ]
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        },
        {
          "body": "Tbh, I would even separate 1 into its own catagory."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "I would say 4 generations. 1, 2, Brotherhood, Revelations. - 3, Liberation, 4 Black Flag, Rogue. - Unity, Syndicate. - Origins, Odyssey, Valhalla.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "I get why you're saying that from a story perspective, but Rogue uses the exact same gameplay elements as AC2, whereas Unity or Origins is massively different.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Yes that's true. I just view it like that because at the time of the build-up hype (trailers/gameplay) before the release of AC3 and when it actually released it felt as such a big difference.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "It definitely did, but at the end of the day it was still counter kill central and simplistic parkour."
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "There are four gens: 1-Revelations, 3-Rogue, Unity & Syndicate, and the last three games.\n\nThe first one (especially AC1 and 2) and the last one (mostly Odyssey, but Valhalla was good as well)\n\nThe middle ones were just nice to explore the open environments but everything else was kinda meh for a few years. Wait a minute, \"a few years\"?🤔\n\nAC3 came out in 2013, right? And Syndicate in 2015..? 6 damn games in two years!? I always forget how Ubi used to print these games like flyers.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Well\n1) AC3 came out in 2012\n 2) You're not including the endpoints\n3) You counted the games wrong it's 3,4, rogue, unity and       syndicate so 5 games\n\n\n so it's actually 5 games in 4 years",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Liberation is in there too. So they are six games. And didn't AC3 come out late 2012?",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "Oh I'm sorry I thought you were counting the main ones. Regardless all the games were built by different teams with overlapping schedules so that's not the reason they failed. The way Ubisoft handled its employees has always been the main issue.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "Yeah yeah, Ubisoft is a big company. The actual development studios are many though.\n\nAnd there's also the whole shitty working environment.\n\nUbisoft the company is no better than EA - another huge company with very talented studios working for them that treat them like shit."
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        },
        {
          "body": "Don't forget Rogue and Unity we're simultaneously released if I recall correctly. One for the Seventh and the other for Eighth generations of consoles, respectively."
        },
        {
          "body": "Yes to four generations in terms of storyline, but not in terms of gameplay. AC2 uses the same base gameplay mechanics as Rogue, just Rogue improved them.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "I kinda disagree because with the same logic, Unity uses the same mechanics as Black Flag, just a bit improved. I'm actually judging each generation based on overall movement & animations, and mechanics & combat.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "Unity is such a massive leap from Black Flag. \n\nNo more easy counter kills. Parkour up/down giving more control. Improved stealth system where you can actually crouch and throw smoke bombs into specific areas.\n\n I'm sorry but that opinion that Unity uses the same mechanics as Black Flag is just outright wrong.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "You like Unity, I get it. But if you believe in a 'correct' answer when asking people for opinions, why did you ask in the first place?",
                      "replies": [
                        {
                          "body": "This has nothing to do with what I'm asking? I'm only asking which games/generation you prefer combat/parkour/stealth wise. \n\nThere's absolutely no way that anyone can deny Unity is a massive change combat/parkour/stealth wise from Rogue. Which is what I'm trying to explain in the previous comment.",
                          "replies": [
                            {
                              "body": "What he's trying to say is the differences between generations are largely defined by the game engines used. That's why most people are defining the generations differently than you.\n\n1-Revelations\n3-Rogue\nUnity-Syndicate\nOrigins-Valhalla\n\nThe groups each use distinct engines, if I recall correctly. Specifically, the new engine introduced in 3 was a huge deal back in the day lol. As someone who played Brotherhood endlessly up to the launch of 3, 3 played so much differently. Having the physics-based animations was a game changer. I definitely disagree with you here but that's okay."
                            }
                          ]
                        }
                      ]
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "I don't know about others, but I really like the parkour system in Unity and Syndicate. They are the only games where I just run around on rooftops and balconies. It's just that parkour feels fluid (unlike previous games) and is (at least for me) really simple. It mainly solves the problem of the rather awkward climbing down from the previous games. I hope Ubisoft goes back to it because I would love to see a remake of AC1 (or any other remake of older games ((mainly Brotherhood and Black Flag))) with this system.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "same here, it'd be the perfect system to use to remaster all the older games."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "If you're into stealth, then Unity and Syndicate.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "best stealth out of the whole entire series."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "I mean, honestly, the unity/syndicate mechanics were the best by a very large margin. The games themselves weren't good, but the movement and combat was so solid, especially unity. Peak of the franchise.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "true true true"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "> I've been seeing a lot of differing opinions on which generation of games are best\n\nthat's because it's hella subjective lmao, there won't be any consensus except for maybe saying the first game is the weakest entry.\n\nfor me, it's something like\n\nParkour - AC:Unity, the movement animation fluidity is (somehow) still unmatched, it's weird how they still unable to replicate this.\n\nCombat - AC:Black Flag, Edward is a fucking demon and seeing him just obliterates enemies with ease is soo satisfying. I wanna say that AC:Odyssey is the runner up in this though.\n\nAdditional Mechanics - AC:Black Flag, still none could top the sailing mechanic of Black Flag, even the sailing in Odyssey is lacking.\n\n\nStory - AC Ezio Trilogy, I think I'm biased because it's simply the most complete character arc in the entire franchise, we see Ezio from his literal birth to his old age (and his death, though that's a short animation).\n\nCharacter - Sokrates, Da Vinci was my favorite up until I played Odyssey, it's just so much fun listening to the guy lol\n\nSetting - AC:Odyssey, ancient Greece just leave my mouth agape at every corner, it's probably the most detailed one in the series.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "I agree with all of those, despite not having played Unity or Odyssey, except for the combat. Despite being part of the same system, I personally prefer AC3's to Black Flag's, simply because you can really feel Ratonhnaké:ton's anger in the animations and he really comes alive when attacking from his natural element of dense vegetation.\n\nI will concede that Edward is certainly a beast of the seas, and it's clear he's highly skilled with swords and pistols. For some reason I just prefer playing as Connor.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "I agree Connor > Edward. But both are great and well suited to their characters personalities."
            }
          ]
        },
        {
          "body": "I agree with all except setting, syndicate was awesome for setting cos London felt so real and alive"
        },
        {
          "body": "i agree except for the combat, ac3 still has the best most satisfying combat with odyssey following closely in my opinion"
        },
        {
          "body": "I agree on parkour absolutely. It was amazing in every sense for me. \n\nCombat I prefer Unity/Syndicate to make it more of a challenge. Pre-Unity it was just too easy, maybe excluding AC1. \n\nYeah, the ship sailing is an unrivalled additional mechanic, only matched in Rogue because it’s a copy and paste job with new bells and whistles. \n\nAgain, I agree on story. Runner up would be Origins for me. I guess I like avenging dead family members. \n\nFor me in terms of characters pre Unity era absolutely crush this. Ezio, Da Vinci, Blackbeard, all the Kenways, Al Mualim. All just amazing characters.\n\nSetting, I’m gonna have to go Origins, but this is mostly personal preference. Very close second is Unity/Syndicate but I have no doubt that if AC2 was done in Unity engine then Florence/Venice would be my #1."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "[removed]",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "This. I couldn’t agree more."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Syndicate had the best movement, IMO. Black Flag the best combat mechanics. Unity the best mission structure.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Unity’s mission structure was so damn good."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "I haven't played all AC games but I have played I, III, Unity, Syndicate, Origins, Odyssey and Valhalla and I gotta say Unity has the best gameplay mechanics by far. I do like Syndicate/Valhalla combat more and I feel the stealth has seen an improvement from Unity to Syndicate. And Unity undoubtedly has the best parkour ever out of any AC game."
    },
    {
      "body": "black flag & unity",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Most fun to play and most realistic. I'd LOVE  a Black Flag remake under Unity system if they can make the ship combat work. Would need to tweak the combat as well to make it suitable for ship combat."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Combat?  \n\\- AC style - Black Flag\n\n\\- RPG style - Odyssey\n\nParkour?\n\n\\- Only Unity.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Fair. Which game would you go for in terms of best stealth?",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "I thinking about AC 2: Brotherhood."
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Unity/Syndicate."
    },
    {
      "body": "Haven't played all the games. The one I have played I have enjoyed apart from AC3 which I found boring.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "think that was a love it or hate it game"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Gen3",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Interesting. What was the first AC game you played? Out of curiosity.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Assassins Creed (2007). I have played them all."
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "4 and Rogue",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "A man of culture, pirate culture."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Like others have said I think a better division would be into 4 eras.\n\nThe narrative of 1-Revelations is still the best to this day.\n\nThe expansion on seamless gameplay in the world as well as secondary systems are the unique highlight of 3-Rogue.\n\nAlbeit absolutely untenable on launch because of glitches the updated parkour as well as the multiplayer in Unity was honestly I think the biggest tragedy for the IP and the biggest potential in all this new live service model stuff coming soon. The missions were basically a cross between Payday and GTA V but Assassins Creed with the boys and they were great.\n\nFinally with the most recent era of Origins-Valhalla I think the biggest gain has been in the worldbuilding, Origins was undeniably beautiful and mysterious as I played through the first time though it suffered from being a wide but shallow lake imo. Odyssey I still contend is an amazing open world RPG but a terrible AC game. If they just removed the Assassin's Creed from the name I think it would actually make the game way better because most of the issues I have surround the overarching narrative and meta plot as well as the MC neither being an Assassin nor having any particular Creed.\n\nOverall I agree there are clear wins in every age of the franchise and we really just need one actual mega stan to get in at Ubisoft, not sexually harass anyone and remind them that the games were at their best when they tried to innovate or do their own thing. Not when they send out surveys after every title asking how much we want a game like RDR2 or the Witcher (surveys I've gotten for all 3 of the last game.)",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "I'd definitely argue theres only the 3 eras, in terms of gameplay mechanics such as combat/parkour/stealth - which is what this post was about. Like I've said on other comments, stealth in AC2 is exactly the same as Rogue, so is parkour and combat but updated.\n\nI agree that if Ubisoft took their time with Unity and it released as it is now, we definitely wouldn't have this new trilogy as that would be the benchmark to meet or beat in future games. \n\nI've only fully played Origins, with less of Odyssey and even less of Valhalla. I feel like it deviates from what AC should be more and more. But I agree Origins had a world that was amazing to explore, it just needed more to actually do.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Yeah I'd definitely accept the 3-Rogue arc as an era 1+ or something, it was the mature form of the previous iterations. \n\nBut the stuff like sailing, the adaptation to wilderness parkour, stuff like actual trading economies and the like were all added during those games and while they didn't hang around they were unique enough for me to see it as distinct personally.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "Oh definitely, if we’re taking into account all gameplay. But just for this to try simplify, I thought it best to stick to the three main pillars of AC gameplay."
                },
                {
                  "body": "Oh definitely, if we’re taking into account all gameplay. But just for this to try simplify, I thought it best to stick to the three main pillars of AC gameplay."
                },
                {
                  "body": "Oh definitely, if we’re taking into account all gameplay. But just for this to try simplify, I thought it best to stick to the three main pillars of AC gameplay."
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Personally I loved the mechanics of odyssey. I'm not a huge fan of the story and it's lack of assassin's and really wish the hidden blade made an appearance but the fighting and parkour and stealth are all top notch in this one in my opinion."
    },
    {
      "body": "I'd say, none of them made the gameplay formula perfect. There are good, yet unique features from all the generations. For example:\n\n* As the starting generation, the original Assassin's Creed, AC II, AC Brotherhood and AC Revelations don't have too much to compete with others, but still have some particular features that are mostly lacking in the further games. For example, hiring factions' members, advanced horse parkour from Brotherhood, parachute and great economy system from Brotherhood and Revelations. However, these are the features \"above\" core gameplay, but not core gameplay itself.\n* The generation of AC III, AC Liberation, AC IV: Black Flag, AC Freedom Cry and AC Rogue is the most pleasant to play for me. You don't have to push two buttons for sprinting now (and can freely use the right stick during that), you can parkour on trees, you can hide in grass, you can whistle, you have the amazing rope dart in your inventory, the combat itself is very flow and pleasant. Is it perfect? No. There are things that further games do better.\n* The brief generation of Unity and Syndicate introduced two important features, but downgraded many other things. These two features are crouch mechanic which should be in any stealth, even \"social stealth\", game and entering many interiors, which gave new experience for players. On a side note, I can mention Syndicate's horse carriages as a traversal feature - yet still not as good as normal horses. However, there's no more grass stealth (which sounds okay with more urban settings) and hidden blade is no longer a choose-able open combat weapon. Still, these games are pretty fine.\n* Finally, the generation of Origins, Odyssey and Valhalla does many important things: restores some old features (grass stealth, horses and boats), introduces pretty comfortable skills usage with LB and introduces a \"bird drone\" which helps in stealth quite much. However, there are lack of (proper) social stealth, too much RPG systems involvement and lack of good old gadgets. Also, the change of control scheme in favor of more soulslike combat and soulslike combat itself are questionable features - like Ubisoft decided to deny  a part of their series' identity.\n\nSo if you ask me, a perfect Assassin's Creed game in core mechanics must have:\n\n* A combination of social stealth and classic stealth - with crouch button and grass hiding;\n* Good old combat from games prior to Origins - with choose-able hidden blade and gadgets, which can be used as skills on LB;\n* Walking by default and sprinting on RT;\n* Horses and boats - with parkour mechanics;\n* Many enterable interiors.\n\nHave to note that it's just core mechanics, as there are many features that also should be in games."
    },
    {
      "body": "I thought that Odyssey was the best fun. The only thing I missed from Origins was that poison would spread. It was really fun playing with poisoned corpses Origins."
    },
    {
      "body": "I wish they add more in-combat finishing animations they feel so repetitive now... I really liked when you could evade at a precise moment and counter attack with an assassination move and then chain it to kill near guards."
    },
    {
      "body": "AC3-Rogue was really the best tbh. Parkour was fun and great lived the big off-hand locations you went to once as they always were a fun parkour challenge. The combat also was fun and made sense, aka the chain killing. If I'm a assassin yeah I'm going to get rid of my enemies soon as possible, not play sword clash with them.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "Gotta disagree on combat. Just cause you’re an assassin doesn’t mean you can solo 20 guards in 5 minutes. It should be harder to push the player to rely on stealth more often.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "I mean I'll agree I want more reliance on stealth more then anything but was still better then rpg series where you could still take on 20 guards lol or unitys ok it's my turn to attack, ok now it's yours.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "hmmm I can see where you’re coming from. I think the RPG combat is the worst for an AC game but it’s fun in its own right",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "I'll give the rpg series this, it's a good historical rpg if it didn't have the assassins creed branding, minus the isu stuff ofc lol"
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "I love all of them because I played them all as they were released.\n\nHowever, I found the mechanics of Syndicate to be particularly enjoyable.  I didn't like the non-jump button but once I got over that, I really enjoyed the way the grappling hook helped you move across the map with ease and the carriages were fun to race around with."
    },
    {
      "body": "the altair - ezio games had a better story and vibe. but with gameplay i gotta go with the kenway era."
    },
    {
      "body": "Ezio trilogy. Complete control over character.\n\nPeople saying unity are blinded by flashy animations"
    },
    {
      "body": "kenway/colonial saga"
    },
    {
      "body": "Imo there is no doubt that the rpg games do not have the best AC gameplay mechanics, so with this in mind, they are very firmly excluded from the following comparison. \n\nHowever, I'm not entirely sure I can decide between the core mechanics of the AC1-Rogue system or the Unity/Syndicate one. They trade blows in a few key areas imo. I preferred the combat and weapon variation in the earlier games, along with the much more in depth parkour controls. I also greatly appreciate that the social stealth system, up to Black Flag anyway, is much better in that you have way more options on hand (hiring goons/courtesans and having control over how you want to use them). However, the newer games improve on stealth by having a crouch mechanic, and their traversal is greatly improved by having smoother animations and less jank in the way the characters move. \n\nI guess if we boiled it down to a simple list, it'd look like this: \n\nAC1-Rogue: better parkour controls, better combat, better weapon variation, better social stealth mechanics. \n\nUnity/Syndicate: more fluid parkour, smoother controls, better solo stealth mechanics. \n\nRpg games: haha climbing mountains go brr.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "In all honesty I agree about the RPG trilogy, I don’t think it masters either of those mechanics. \n\nI personally prefer Unity/Syndicate combat as it feels more grounded. I get why people don’t like it, as it is a major jump. \n\nI think weapon variety is definitely a lot better in Unity at least, and not too bad in Syndicate. \n\nSocial stealth is definitely better in the earlier games. I hope that’s reintegrated in a similar way, but with the crowds of Unity. \n\nAnd I definitely agree that overall stealth and parkour is better in Unity/Syndicate.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Fair. \n\nWhen I said weapon variety I was mostly focused on the aspect in the Ezio trilogy where you could pick up literally anything and fight with it, and also all the mods that were made to the hidden blade without sacrificing their core functionality. Unity sacrifices the dual hidden blade for the phantom blade, which is, well, uncool imo. My ideal protagonist would have Shay's dart gun and Ezio's fully decked out hidden blades.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "I'm sure in Unity you can use every weapon available to pick up in AC2 as your primary weapon. But still that was an amazing feature of AC2. \n\nVery good point about the hidden blades. Ezios blades were arguably the best we've saw yet. Shay's dart gun would've been great as well.",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "> I'm sure in Unity you can use every weapon available to pick up in AC2 as your primary weapon\n\nThe broom would like a word with you",
                      "replies": [
                        {
                          "body": "oh holy broom, forgive me for my sins",
                          "replies": [
                            {
                              "body": "You are forgiven"
                            }
                          ]
                        }
                      ]
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "In my opinion, the RPG games (Origins, Odyssey, Valhalla) have been the best for me when it comes to gameplay. The main reason for this is the inclusion of bow types and skills in these games. I've always found the bow to be a versatile and exciting weapon in any video game, be it Far Cry, Tomb Raider, Horizon, RDR, and its addition in the RPG AC titles enhanced my overall gaming experience.  \nOne aspect that I never found particularly thrilling in earlier Assassin's Creed titles was the gunplay. While guns were available in those games, they often lacked the stealthy element that I enjoyed. Additionally, the use of throwing knives and darts in earlier titles felt clunky and complicated to execute. In contrast, the RPG games presented a more refined and enjoyable approach to ranged combat, with the bow as an important weapon for each protagonist.  \n  \nAlthough Assassin's Creed III had a bow, it wasn't as good as the RPG games. The RPG bows had more versatility and depth, which AC3's lacked. Additionally, it seemed like a chore having to waste time in AC3 purchasing, crafting, or looting arrows because it was such a long and tedious procedure. I've always like how simple the arrow looting in the RPG was designed, as well as how they were dispersed over the map in military barracks, training dummies, woodland trees, dead animals, etc."
    },
    {
      "body": "The RPG generation, and Odyssey specifically. It was AC at its very best",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "I can objectively see how they are good games. But other than Origins, they're not good 'Assassin's Creed' games.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "How original",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": "please explain how Odyssey is an Assassin’s Creed game, other than in name?",
                  "replies": [
                    {
                      "body": "It's in the same universe, faces the same themes, expands the lore. You use a broken spear instead of a hidden blade, but it's just a different animation.",
                      "replies": [
                        {
                          "body": "may follow the same themes of good vs bad but in Odyssey for instance, there's no creed/brotherhood - ultimately the main aspect of an AC game. Odyssey is just a mercenary game that's been given the AC name to improve sales. I can't speak as much on Valhalla, as I've only played that for about 20 hrs before giving up on it.",
                          "replies": [
                            {
                              "body": "Black flag, 3 and syndicate barely have the brotherhood in them, origins has none. Odyssey, together with unity, has the best assassin power fantasy of the series. People who shit on it still follow a 4 years old bandwagon that's already died."
                            }
                          ]
                        }
                      ]
                    }
                  ]
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "IMO Origins does not deserve to be lumped in with Odyssey and Valhalla. Defined protagonist, no dialog options, gear progression is substantially different…I find is more similar to Unity and Syndicate despite the fact that it starts the Mythological trilogy",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "The gameplay is massively different. I’m more so talking about combat / parkour / stealth. It’s definitely closer to Odyssey / Valhalla in that regard."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Gen 4, hands down no contest.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "controversial",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Where I’m comin from is a place of the mechanics not feeling too too repetitive. I can kill hundreds of enemy without feeling burned out on combat. I have so many options to mix it up. The earlier generations I felt like I was going through the same kill sequences over and over."
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Of course the new ones, old ACs suck ass"
    },
    {
      "body": "For Parkour I'd say I prefer the Altair and Ezio games, maybe it's just because I've played them the most but I find myself having a lot more control over my character's movements with abilities like side jumping, ledge grabbing and all that with the Hookblade then making climbing a lot faster and more fun. I love the vault added by the Kenway games and whenever you're in trees it's really good but a bit more automated and lacking the control you have over Ezio. The RPG climbing sucks, it's just straight up bad.\n\nFor Combat I'd say most games have their ups and downs, I didn't like Origins or Odyssey's combat much at all but Valhalla's was fun and interesting, I expected to hate it when I saw it copied Souls but it's actually really fun. Syndicate's combat is very similar to the Kenway games in that it's pretty easy but pretty bombastic however the Kenway games are a lot more fluid. 1, 2 and Unity are all a lot harder and more skillful than the other combat systems which can make them more tense and exciting, things like AC2's strafe and AC1's leg breaking are cool little mechanics as well. Revelations and Brotherhood are a nice balance between the skillful systems of 1 and 2 and the easy one man army of the Kenway games (still easy but a bit more thoughtful).\n\nFor Stealth there's 2 categories, classic and social and they aren't particularly good or bad depending on engine rather the level design. For classic I'd probably say either Black Flag or Syndicate are the best, the level designs are great and the whistle is really taken for granted until you lose it in Unity. The worst in this category would be all of them since the game just aren't great for that however the stealth damage mechanics of the RPG games is just stupid so they take the worst spot.\n\nFor Social Stealth I have to give it to 2 and Syndicate, the Ezio games all have similar mechanics for social stealth however 2 is definitely the best designed with them in mind with Revelations nipping at its heels (for some reason Brotherhood decided to barely include them). Syndicate's kidnapping mechanic is really fun to use and gives a bit more risk to social stealth. The worst in this category would obviously be Origins and Odyssey because it doesn't have it at all (though if we disqualify them for that reason then Valhalla's is clunky as hell)."
    },
    {
      "body": "I can't remember if previous games did it, but I like that you can just knock out nearly every enemy in Odyssey instead of killing them."
    },
    {
      "body": "The AC1-Rev generation is my favorite by far, because it gives you the most control over your character and has the most room for player- and skill expression. Social stealth is at its best, and so is movement. \n\nAC3-Rogue is pretty much the same system but ~~dumbed down~~ more accessible and with cooler animations, but more on rails and harder to control precisely. Some additions are good - I love the free aim and more options for traditional stealth.\n\nACU-S has even less control of your character and more flashy animations. It is inconsistent and difficult to control where you go, and the game does too much for you to prevent you from screwing up, which limits your freedom. Crouch button is a nice addition and the traditional stealth works well, but social stealth is quite lacking.\n\nACO-V has the worst movement in the series. You can only go up and down, no ejects, no grab ledge, nothing to discern a skilled player from a newbie. Stealth is inconsistent in different ways depending on the game, and social stealth doesn't even exist. I prefer hitbox combat over animation based though, since again, more direct control of your character. \n\nSUMMARY:\n\nBest movement: AC1-Rev\n\nBest stealth: AC1-Rev (ACU-S for traditional stealth)\n\nBest combat: ACO-V"
    },
    {
      "body": "As many people in the comments have said, I too am of the opinion of there being 4 generations, even though the III-Rogue era seems like a rework of the AC I-Revelations gameplay, they added so many more elements and improved the stealth options by a thousandfold. \n\nI haven't played Assassin's creed I, Revelations, Unity, Syndicate & the RPGs yet, but I have played AC II, III, Liberation, IV & Rogue (my first) and I'm playing through Brotherhood rn. And for me personally, I much prefer the combat system and the multiple stealth options in the III-Rogue generation compared to the Ezio Trilogy. I like how smooth the combat and the UI are in the Kenway saga compared to the Ezio Trilogy. Also I am completely biased thanks to naval combat which was such an amazing addition to the game.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "I agree that there’s definitely four generations overall. But in terms of combat/parkour/stealth there just simply isn’t in my opinion. \n\nI do admit III-Rogue improved stealth by adding hiding in tall grass and whistling. Plus the addition of the sleep darts in Black Flag/Rogue. But because the Combat and Parkour is simply AC1 systems just slightly improved, I don’t think that warrants defining it in its own generation when only considering the main three pillars of AC games. \n\nPlus, AC2 and Black Flag are my top two games, so I get everything you’re saying there. Naval warfare for the win.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Tbf you do make a good point in the combat system since AC III-Rogue was just a much more polished and refined counter system. But to me, it feels like they are two completely different systems for some reason. I don't know how to explain it but yeah, they feel different, yet the same."
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "as others have said there are 4 gens of AC. I prefer the 1st gen (1-Revelations) as you had more control over the parkour albeit the easy combat. The combat for the RPG trilogy is okay but its alot of whacking at numbers.2nd Gen (3-Rogue) made parkour too easy and i didnt care for the combat much in Unity/ Syndicate but the stealth was much better"
    }
  ]
}