Rufous

{
  "post": {
    "title": "Diablo 4 skill tree - comparing with diablo 2&3 skill tree",
    "selftext": "[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCyXqYkLyEc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCyXqYkLyEc)\n\nwould love some feedback if you got any chuck it my way.\n\npizza and prosperity",
    "url": "https://www.reddit.com/r/diablo4/comments/11zf6ue/diablo_4_skill_tree_comparing_with_diablo_23/"
  },
  "comments": [
    {
      "body": "Stop comparing all the diablo games is my advice.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "not comparing just showing the basic structure it is inspired from when it comes to the tree. As to the rest it is more to argue that D4 gameplay will be closer to D3 than it is to an mmo or something like AoE"
        },
        {
          "body": "^^This^^"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Well comparison is that D4 offers some combination Between D2 and D3 skill system.  \nSkill specific effects that we can only choose 1 out of 2 is sort of the D3 style.  \nThe progression path ( put 2 points here so you can access next row of skills ) is sort of D2 style.  \nHowever based on the number of skills available, also the number of passive skills as well and the number of Points to allocate is leaning more towards D2 - You just can't have everything.  \n\n\nD3 system was basically you had all the abilities with all runes available at all times. And the only thing mattered was that Which ones you pick at a certain time, swapping between this and that before Bosses or else.  \n\n\nIn D4 would be more like in D2 - if you have invested into certain skills/passives you stick with them, especially after Paragon boards. It's easy to respec at early levels , but once you get to the paragon boards I don't think it would be that easy to change those boards once you have chosen."
    },
    {
      "body": "Every Diablo game is massively different.   Its the same core concept but they add and take away things for each of them keeping the best bits.   \n\n\nDiablo 3 was the first diablo for the \"modern\" generation and it varied wildly from the previous generations game to make it as accessible as possible.   This had a negative impact over all.   \n\n\nSkill trees are so wildly different and aimed at different generations of gamers its difficult to compare them without just highlighting flaws.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "yes indeed, my argument is more that the gameplay wont be like a mmo nor like a turn based rpg but due to the rng a lot more 'erratic' as to the skill tree i was showing how both the diablo 3 (tiers) and diablo 2 tree (skill points) comes together diablo 4.\n\ntyvm for the advice! \n\npizza and prosperity"
        },
        {
          "body": "They’re different yes but 1 and 2 were good so it’s a shame it stopped there. Oh well…",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "the d4 tree takes inspiration from both and in a good way. the skill points from d3 and the tiers and runes from d3 are the basic structure of the d4 tree. it also says a lot on how the gameplay will be compared to mmos and turn based rpg's which is what most of the community approaching the game think it is. They will be massively overwhelmed especially if the advice is coming from mmo games or turnbasedrpgs. The d3 community has been very competitive in the last years"
            }
          ]
        },
        {
          "body": ">Diablo 3 was the first diablo for the \"modern\" generation and it varied wildly from the previous generations game to make it as accessible as possible.   This had a negative impact over all.\n\nYes it had negative impact. Not at the beginning tho. It started when they introduced 10000% dmg multiplier Sets and a simple 3000 damage end-game Diablo 2 game resulted into 3000 billions of damage. That's straight up dumb, there is no need for that exaggeration.  \nAlso Realm Lobby in Diablo 2 is what is missing in Diablo 3. You don't have the same multiplayer online atmosphere as it was in Diablo 2. Diablo 3 felt like local party thing more leaning towards Single-player. And after Reaper of Souls, almost entirely became Single-player game.  \n\n\nThat is mostly due to the concept of Multiplayer Online games. You must feel it's multiplayer online game and has appropriate atmosphere.  \nDiablo 3 has none of that. The only thing that was somewhat leaning towards that Multiplayer feeling was the Auction House. Once they removed it the game felt like any other single-player game and that is huge letdown for a Title : Multiplayer Online game.  \n\n\nBasically previous generation devs literally had better idea of what Online Multiplayer game should be like. Current generation devs only know what an Online Multiplayer Leaderboard game is - just so there is straight forward competition of who has more than me that you can check at any given moment and to trick you into spending cash into the Shop ( -- Diablo Immortal -- ).  \n\n\nBottom line is  :  \n  1 . Previous generation games were build up with the idea to be interesting and fun experience while playing them. And push the development further by learning new things.  \n 2. Current generation games are build up with the idea to be profitable for whoever is making them. Interesting and fun experience is no longer important - it's only important to stay as long as possible online and buy as many things in the shop.  \nAnd of course to push further software development mostly leaning towards shareholders in hardware manufacturers. Because most games nowadays seems like just a way to make people continue buying the newest generation of hardware by having almost non-existent interesting game designs but multimillion dollars invested into pure graphics.",
          "replies": [
            {
              "body": "Diablo 3 was a huge issue from launch with this loot system, The AH and the lack of content.\n\nIT was Turned around with Loot 2.0 and then followed closely by sets which allowed the casual audience to return and quickly progress.\n\nNo, previous generation of games werent built to be fun and interesting whilst learning new things.  They were for the same thing primarily Profit.  Old developers and old games are not made with your feelings in mind or the developer being your friend.\n\nJust like current games, they were made for profit first with the consumer way down the list.   Only difference today is the market has changed and developers and publishers know the consumer is likely to spend more if they have the option to do so.\n\nTodays gaming market is flooded and games are no longer one hit wonders that stay around, They fade into the background when the new game is released so maximising profits up front is the only secure way to ensure the company continues to go on.  \n\n\nThis old \"back in my day\" crap isnt a thing in the gaming industry.  It has always been about profit and how they can get that money from you even when games moved online and expansions started to be sold all the way to modern day MTX.   \n\n\nThe only difference between now and then is games had to be fully fleshed out prior to launch and not launched acceptably and improved later.",
              "replies": [
                {
                  "body": ">Diablo 3 was a huge issue from launch with this loot system, The AH and the lack of content.  \n>  \n>IT was Turned around with Loot 2.0 and then followed closely by sets which allowed the casual audience to return and quickly progress.\n\nTurned around? People have quit when they saw the news about Both AH are going down. I quit at that time as well when i found out everything becomes bound. RMAH was not the was threw me off the game, the normal AH did so.  \nLoot 2.0 was literally what turned me down to never touch this game.  \nI personally \"Multiplayer Online\" games that are purely Single-player. Because on the market they are even better games than D3 who are not multiplayer Online and their solo experience is far better than even Diablo.  \n   \n *Todays gaming market is flooded and games are no longer one hit wonders that stay around, They fade into the background when the new game is released so maximising profits up front is the only secure way to ensure the company continues to go on.*   \n\n\nYes. Because that's the idea behind promoting, advertising something as what it is not, promising development and then once you get into the game everyone see it's uncooked and very bad designed but had very hard focus on monetization at the start with predatory strategies to milk as much money as possible before project gets abandoned, because even the devs of those games know that the goal is not to make a good game, but to sell convenience.  \n\n\nI am curious tho - Did blizzard ever mentioned that there is legendary crests that cost $2.50 for Diablo Immortal when they were promoting/advertising the game??? NO. They did NOT. Did they mention that a $25 juiced up Dungeon will drop as much as 100 non-juiced up dungeons in terms of chance to find something good? No. THey did NOT.  \nWhy?? Because no one would accept it. However sheeps bought the hook and company makes a fortune  \n==============================================================  \nThis >>>>>  \n *No, previous generation of games werent built to be fun and interesting whilst learning new things. They were for the same thing primarily Profit. Old developers and old games are not made with your feelings in mind or the developer being your friend.*  \n\n\nAll the MOST successful games nowadays : Diablo 1, Diablo 2, CS:GO, League of Legends, DOTA.  \nYes they are MOBA/Shooter type of games. They have their own charm just by being PvP short-term pure fun games but let me tell you something :  \nCounter-Strike was created from a student nerd as a Fan Based Custom Half Life MOD. IT WAS CREATED FOR PURE FUN because this Nerd loved Half Life and created a MOD himself to have fun with his friends.  \n\n\nBoth DOTA and League of Legends were created by the community of Warcraft 3 - ALSO FOR PURE FUN.  \n\n\nCompanies afterwards saw the potential and even hired some of those people ( the nerd of counter-strike ).  \n\n\nDiablo 1 was created by 3 people in a basement garage but it was not called Diablo. A long time after that their project was recognized by Blizzard themselves and those 3 people got offered a job if they let their product be labaled as Blizzard product.  \nAfter that those same 3 people were appointed as Lead Team for Diablo 2 - And that is how Diablo 2 came.  \n\n\nSo yeah you tell me about how old generation devs \"did not make games for FUN\"."
                }
              ]
            }
          ]
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "body": "Your first mistake is comparing previous Diablo with this one.\n\nJust stop.",
      "replies": [
        {
          "body": "the video is not specifically about that  but the skill tree from d4 takes a lot of elements from both d3 and d4"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}